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Thread: Every time:)

  1. #8
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    I can't upload pictures on this forum. I dont think we're meant to. But one of the pictures MarkD posted in the thread "stepping out of the onshore rut" illustrates the rig handling well. The fact that you typically loose much speed when climbing up front side for a top turn, can probably explain why you'll find more pictures of fast bottom turns or top turns. But there will be no top turn unless you first make it there.

    The problem with discussing technique is that what you do and what you think you're doing maybe different things. And that explainations or mantras that make sense to me may make no sense to you.

    Let me try an alternative explaination with focus on arms (mast arm is still the one closest to the mast, boom arm is other!):

    Bottom turn entry: Push out with mast arm while pulling in on boom arm.

    Upon feeling that the pull on your boom hand gets light as you turn through down wind: Push out also with your boom arm.

    Now immediately after: Start swinging the rig out of the turn as far as your shoulders allow. You will naturally still be able to see your clew if you want to. But your focus should be more upwind at the section you want to hit.

    How fast and far you need or want to swing your rig out of the turn depends on how onshore the wave is and how much speed you were able to generate and keep through the bottom turn. When riding "unrideable wavelets" like I do, just getting the rig out of sight the moment it gets light seems to do the trick. That being said, my power control is good and I probably also do some sheeting adjustments with one or both arms or by adjusting how fast I swing my arms out or twist my body etc. But as a starting point for people tired of straightlining and missing the critical section (I never see a very critical section up here, mind you), just getting the rig out and back in a hurry may do the trick.

    You should still feel pull from the sail and you'll technically speaking be sailing clew first switch stance as you're supposed to, but you will hold the rig more to the outside of your body and the mast will tilt out and rearwards - quite opposite to how it should point on entering the bottom turn. And the change from tipping the rig forwards and in, to swinging it out and back, should take no more than a couple of seconds.
    Last edited by boards_Tomas; 8th September 2016 at 09:57 AM.
    The infamous wavewriter

  2. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by basher View Post
    I actually love threads like these, and would happily give a detailed and opinionated answer – if I knew what was being asked or discussed.
    Thanks Basher for using a nicer tone! But I'm actually trying to provide answers here rather than ask questions. If you want to comment you first need to do some reading. Sorry about that.
    The infamous wavewriter

  3. #10
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    This is a pretty good vid of pros sailing in typical UK onshore conditions (although its from sylt). The wave sailing starts at c5mins.

    Its noticable that they dont hold a clew first postion for any length of time and the backside top turns are as whippy as what they are trying to do clew first. Clew first is tough as the physics are against you. I dont think there is any magic with what you can do with the rig, just hold it as neutral as possible and focus on the timing.

  4. #11
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    Thanks for posting Bob. As Basher keeps repeating it's all about appearant wind. And although most people would describe Sylt as an onshore spot, the size and speed of those waves in combination with the skill level of the riders enable them to keep speed up throughout the ride. My tip applies mostly for people and situations where it's really hard to get even close to vertical without stalling or back winding. The huge differences in talent, strength and conditions means that we perhaps can't learn a lot from simply watching pros.

    Note that if you swing the rig out too fast and far you will effectively over sheet. That may only be slightly better than back winding. But in the crappiest most onshore stuff, back winding is the more common problem. With experience you'll know or feel how fast and far you need to swing the rig out (aka "open up clew first"). And as you get better and catch better waves your increased speed will make back winding less of a problem.
    The infamous wavewriter

  5. #12
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    http://www.tushingham.com/windsurfin..._Tushrock1.jpg

    If you look at Hart in that picture you'll perhaps see what I mean. It may at first look as if he's stretching the rig forwards. Wrong! He's swinging it out and back while his body goes in and forwards. And this is my whole point. The need for going on and on about "swinging the rig out and back" is that most people intuitively think about clew first sailing as having to "keep the rig stretched forwards at any cost". That's what I did myself for years and what I think I see many other wouldbees do. It may work for freestylers going fast on a broad course to do a trick. But not when you need to keep turning far into the wind on a crappy wave with little speed.

    PS My typical wave really isn't a lot bigger than in the picture. And I'm exactly his age. Perhaps if you're made of rubber or into contortion you'll prefer to twist ninety degrees at the waist. Us grown ups need to get smart or else hang up. I never sail more than two hundred meters in a straight line between transitions and am still a wreck from the sailing two days ago. Will try and see if I can get out of the tub now.
    Last edited by boards_Tomas; 8th September 2016 at 02:26 PM.
    The infamous wavewriter

  6. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by boards_Tomas View Post
    http://www.tushingham.com/windsurfin..._Tushrock1.jpg

    If you look at Hart in that picture you'll perhaps see what I mean. It may at first look as if he's stretching the rig forwards. Wrong! He's swinging it out and back while his body goes in and forwards. And this is my whole point. The need for going on and on about "swinging the rig out and back" is that most people intuitively think about clew first sailing as having to "keep the rig stretched forwards at any cost". That's what I did myself for years and what I think I see many other wouldbees do. It may work for freestylers going fast on a broad course to do a trick. But not when you need to keep turning far into the wind on a crappy wave with little speed.

    PS My typical wave really isn't a lot bigger than in the picture. And I'm exactly his age. Perhaps if you're made of rubber or into contortion you'll prefer to twist ninety degrees at the waist. Us grown ups need to get smart or else hang up. I never sail more than two hundred meters in a straight line between transitions and am still a wreck from the sailing two days ago. Will try and see if I can get out of the tub now.
    I bump for more people to see that picture! If someone nerdy can display it as a picture rather than an attachment that would be good. The reason why I keep on about this issue is I don't get confirmation from the high cred'ers. That could mean I'm totally wrong. I still don't think so.
    The infamous wavewriter

  7. #14
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    Nerd alert


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